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Why You Can’t Get Married, Part 2

Delusional Bride

Delusional Bride

Part 1 of this 2-part series was focused on women who couldn’t find a steady man period, much less one to marry. Part 2 is going to focus on women who can get long-term relationships but are unable to get the men in question to marry them.

One of my favorite books is The 48 Laws of Power by Robert Greene. And one of the laws in the book is especially relevant to this topic, and it’s the one that women who want to marry ignore the most. It is Law 13, and it reads as follows:

Law 13

When Asking for Help, Appeal to People’s Self-Interest, Never to their Mercy or Gratitude. If you need to turn to an ally for help, do not bother to remind him of your past assistance and good deeds. He will find a way to ignore you. Instead, uncover something in your request, or in your alliance with him, that will benefit him, and emphasize it out of all proportion. He will respond enthusiastically when he sees something to be gained for himself.

Women, when trying to get men to marry them, violate this rule all the time, and I’ll explain how.

What do women often say when they have finished playing the field and enjoying their teens and 20s and they now feel it’s time to get married? They tell a guy “I’m not getting any younger.” [Translation: "My looks are fading."] “My biological clock is ticking.” “All my friends are getting married.” “I’ve given up so much for you.” “I invested too much time into this relationship for it not to be leading to marriage. You wasted/ruined the best years of my life!”

All of these and many of the other pleas women use to get men to marry them, as you can see, appeal to gratitude (“l gave you my best years. I deserve marriage.”) or mercy (“I am getting older, less desirable with age and all my friends are getting married. I need to get married now.”). The problem with gratitude is that people resent having it dangled over them and being reminded of it. Especially if they don’t value what you did for them as much as you do. For example, any man who isn’t a chump with low self-esteem won’t think you choosing to be with them is some kind of huge favor. They’d prefer to think of it as a mutual favor at best. The problem with appealing to mercy or pity is that there is no shortage of people in need. If just going by need, there will always be someone in worse circumstances who needs the mercy or pity even more than you do. And need is not attractive. Keep in mind, banks rarely lend to people who need money the most, yet to people who already have money they can’t lend enough.

If you want to get your man to marry you, don’t try to sell the idea to him by emphasizing how much it will benefit you or how much you “deserve” and “need” it. Focus on how it will benefit him. Too many women only focus on their own perspective in the matter and not the man’s.

Picture being a job applicant and having this approach to selling yourself. You go to prospective employers telling them how much you need the job, mentioning how you’re on the verge of poverty and how you’ve exhausted your other employment options and conveying your desperation. What would that employer do? He’d either wonder why you have so few options and be turned off by your desperation, or he’ll take advantage of your state of need by underpaying you, giving you a lower job title than you feel qualified for or exploiting and manipulating you once you’re hired because he’ll know how badly you need to keep the job. No, what you do is downplay how much you need the job, act like you have plenty of options, present the strongest image of yourself that you can and focusing on how you can benefit the prospective employer more than how the employer can benefit you. This is the same approach you need to take toward getting your man to marry you.

So let’s look at the balance of power going into a marriage situation and see what each side has to gain and offer. In part 1, I laid the case for why a woman’s strongest assets are her youth and age rather than her credentials and career status.  Now on the male side of the equation, what gives him value are career status, social intelligence, confidence, power, stability and wealth. Unlike a woman’s main assets, youth and age, these assets of the male increase rather than decrease with age. Many men growing up don’t realize how much their stock will rise with age until it happens. In fact, our society has become so feminized that many men grow up thinking like women, fearing turning 30, focusing on their looks as metrosexuals and thinking their stock will fall with age the way women’s stock does.

But when men do start acquiring success, money and stability, start getting more comfortable with and less intimidated by women and start becoming consistently successful with women for the first time in their lives, they are placed in a situation they’ve never been in before. For once, they actually have the upper hand in the dating game. After years and years of chasing after women like hungry lapdogs and putting them on pedestals, they are suddenly in a position they never saw coming. They are now the prize, and they now want to make up for all the years when they weren’t. This is the mindset you’re now dealing with, ladies.  You need to understand it in order to handle it correctly.

So as a woman you have to place yourself in a man’s shoes. Up until now you’ve been in the driver’s seat, making men jump through hoops and twisting them around your finger at will while sitting on the top of the dating food chain. Young guys with their lack of money, status and game accepted their lower status without a fight and begged and even tried to buy approval. Now at the exact time that the tables are turning, roles are reversing and your stock is declining, you are asking a man to settle down with one woman at the exact moment his dating stock is at the highest it has ever been and only stands to rise higher. He can afford his own apartment without roommates, is on a good career track, is no longer intimidated by women and has game, he is accumulating wealth and savings, he has more sexual experience and is no longer as clueless and intimidated in the bedroom, plus with all this rising dating stock, we know we have the option of dating younger and hotter than at any point in our lives, including the period of our lives when we ourselves were younger and hotter. So it’s not a lack of maturity keeping men from committing, it’s a lack of incentives. We as men see your incentive for wanting to get married, because your biological clock is ticking and your looks are fading and all your friends are getting married. We just don’t see the incentives for ourselves. Throw in all the divorce laws and other reasons why marriage is a bad deal for men and it just gets worse. This article also lays out all the liabilities men expose themselves to thanks to current divorce laws (emphasis added by me):

Sudden Divorce Syndrome. You won?t find it in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, that bible of psychiatric illnesses, but you will find it in life. In a 2004 poll by the AARP, one in four men who were divorced in the previous year said they ?never saw it coming.? (Only 14 percent of divorced women said they experienced the same unexpected broadside.) And few events in a man?s life can be as devastating to his physical, mental, and financial health…

The warning signs are usually there, claims Buckley, but the male mind is simply not very adept at recognizing them. ?When women make up their mind that the relationship is over, they stop talking about the relationship,? she says. ?Men interpret a woman?s lack of complaining as satisfaction. But more often, it?s because she?s simply given up.?

To understand how common this scenario is, consider figures provided by John Guidubaldi, a former member of the U.S. Commission on Child and Family Welfare. Nationwide, Guidubaldi reports, wives are the ones to file for divorce 66 percent of the time, and, in some years, that figure has soared to nearly 75 percent. ?It is easier to end a marriage than it is to fire an employee,? says Guidubaldi. If she wants out, it?s over. ?You can get a dissolution of marriage on the basis of nothing.?

Oftentimes, men have a divorce sprung on them in midlife, when their kids are more self-sufficient and they?ve finally started to think they were over the hump. Like Martin Paul, they could start to relax. But that?s exactly the time of life when the instance of divorce begins to swell (another occurs shortly after marriage). Joe Cordell, of the law firm Cordell and Cordell, which specializes in ?representing men in domestic cases, attributes this to wives deciding as they approach age 40 that it?s now or never for getting back into the marriage market. It?s the same phenomenon as rich guys trading in their long-time partners for trophy wives. Only it?s the women who are shedding men.

It didn?t used to be this way. While divorce has been legal for nearly two centuries, it was long a topic of such mortification that it was considered a last, desperate resort. The 1960s changed all that. The free-love decade both increased the inclination to divorce and dropped the social resistance to it. The rising financial independence of women began to free them from a need to stay in a stultifying or abusive marriage. As a result, divorce soared, doubling by most measures. But the stereotypical divorce story?man marries, starts a family, meets a younger women, and leaves his wife?just isn?t as common as we are led to believe.

?Marriage changes men more pervasively and more profoundly than it changes women,? explains sociologist Steven Nock, author of Marriage in Men?s Lives. ?The best way to put it is, marriage is for men what motherhood is for women.? Marriage makes men grow up. Nock observes that many men before marriage are indifferent workers, and, after hours, are likely to be found in bars or zoned out in front of a TV. After marriage, they are solid wage earners, frequent churchgoers, maybe members of a neighborhood protection association. But divorce takes that underpinning away, leaving men strangely infantilized and unsure of their place in the world. They feel like interlopers in the stands at their children?s soccer games or in the auditorium for their school plays.

Compounding this pain, men find the deck is stacked against them. The divorce system tends to award wives custody of the children, substantial child support, the marital home, half the couple?s assets, and, often, heavy alimony payments.

This may come as startling news to a public that has been led to believe that women are the ones who suffer financially postdivorce, not men. But the data show otherwise, according to an exhaustive study of the subject by Sanford L. Braver, a professor of psychology at Arizona State University and author of

Divorced Dads: Shattering the Myths. ?The man is in a lot poorer condition than the popular media portray,? he says. ?This idea of the swinging, happy-go-lucky, no-worries single guy in a bar?that?s just not it at all.? The misconception was fueled by Harvard professor Lenore Weitzman?s widely cited book, The Divorce Revolution: The Unexpected Social and Economic Consequences for Women and Children in America.

This is what you’re working against. And focusing even more on your own reasons for getting married will do no good. What you need to do is show how the incentives of getting married to you specifically outweigh all the incentives he has to stay single. So a guy is receiving the loss of his most enjoyable, prime dating years after a woman has already enjoyed her prime dating years, is receiving sex with one woman for the rest of his life, which will likely only decrease after marriage, is risking putting all his financial progress at risk if there’s a divorce thanks to divorce laws that are stacked against him, is risking bitter custody battles for any kids he may have, having to face a court system that presumptively sides with the woman when any charges of neglect, infidelity and emotional and physical abuse are levied…you can see why the fact that you’re getting older just isn’t enough justification for him.

So here’s what you have to do. First, follow the rules laid out in my perfect woman post to the letter. Also, take note of a comment left by a reader Mike in response to part 1 of this post:

I agree with your assessment about age/looks being a critical factor, but what about domestic skills – cooking, cleaning, etc. – and intangibles – non-materialistic values, interest compatibility, etc. – that many guys like myself view as prerequisites for wife status? Do these not factor in, or are they just assumed like ?good sex??

Feminism has convinced women that excelling in domestic skills that Mike mentions are a form of weakness or accepting oppressive tradition. I run into many women who even take pride in not knowing how to cook and hiring cleaning ladies rather than cleaning themselves. If you are willing to excel in these areas, you are adding much more value to yourself than you are from getting an excellent career. Now more than ever these skills are rare in women, while nowadays hypereducated career women are almost a dime a dozen. And honestly, most men suck at cooking and cleaning house, but most men are able to make ends meet, eat takeout and hire a cleaning lady. Take a look at the average guy’s bachelor pad and it’s usually a cluttered mess with tons of takeout boxes and TV dinners. Having someone else who makes money, can’t cook or clean and is able to hire a cleaning lady is redundant. Someone who can do those things however offers things the guy can’t do as well himself.

In addition, learn some of the advantages for men that come from marriage and sell those to him rather than focus on the disadvantages that come to you from not being married. For starters, married men tend to be more productive and successful across professions, stay in better physical and mental health, and are less likely to engage in “risky behaviors” which helps them live longer. Research as many benefits to men from marriage as you can and use them to sell him on the idea.  I’ll let you in on a secret: much of this research is actually debatable and shaky.  But that’s between you and me, he doesn’t need to know that.  What matters is that many reputable sources trumpet these studies as valid, and the power of authority (study conducted by doctor, at Harvard, and printed in NY Times) is good enough proof for most people.

And lastly, give indications that if he marries you, he will not be at risk of many of the downsides that usually scare men away from marriage. Give indications that you plan to actually have more sex with him after marriage, not less. Guys always hear stories from their married friends about how sex slows down after marriage while blow jobs stop completely. Coyly purr things like “Once we’re married, I’m so going to wear you out every day. I hope you’re up to it.” (Or whatever wording works for you) Hint that blow jobs will increase exponentially. Don’t battle over the prenup if it’s important to him. Let him know all the ways having you around will make his daily grind easier. Take a top-notch cooking class and say it’s for him. If he’s into working out and eating healthy, learn to cook a dazzling array of low-calorie, high-flavor dishes. Show him articles like this one about the recent rash of wives who immediately left their investment banker husbands and hired divorce lawyers after they got laid off of Wall Street and the shopping sprees and Hamptons trips dried up, and mention how outraged and disgusted you are by such behavior and how you are totally unsympathetic to them, thereby planting the seed in his mind that his worst fears in a future wife won’t apply to you. Find out what causes him the most grief in his daily life, what his most dreaded chores or tasks are, and find a way to indicate that being married to you will alleviate that aspect of his life.

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30 Responses to “Why You Can’t Get Married, Part 2”


  1. I dig this post, I think women would benefit a lot from this info. Fortunately I think a lot of this is really coming to light these days – just the other day I was (gayly) watching Oprah and there were all these women on who were 40 something wanting to get pregnant and realizing they had wasted their lives on careers, etc. Again, I think babies/homemaker isnt for every woman, but most I think would value the role if they weren’t raised to believe it was so horrible. It’s so lame how girls will brag about not knowing how to cook, I’ve come across that myself. Again, I don’t think women should NOT be in the workforce, pursue careers, etc, but more traditional marriage roles are definitely underrated these days. It can be sort of depressing to look at ourselves as basically fruit flies – we are born, we fuck to reproduce, and we die – as if that’s our only purpose. On a far removed level, though, that’s pretty much it, so why not do what we were made to do?


  2. bra-vo. and good look on the inclusion.

    top notch post as always, keep up the great work.


  3. Also, don’t let the guy string you along. Set a date that he either commits or you move on. And especially don’t live him. You will think you are moving towards a committment, but actually are not. And all the while you will be providing him with the benefits of marriage (cooking, cleaning etc.) without getting any of the committment in return. Bad deal.

    Thursdays last blog post..Publication


  4. That should read:
    “And especially don’t live with him.”

    Thursdays last blog post..Publication


  5. I think you’re underrating the positive effects of a career for women – using Donald Trump, or any other other billionaire tycoon as an example is not relevant to most women. There’s maybe a couple dozen of these men around and most women do not seriously imagine meeting, let alone marrying one of them. By “high-status” I assume you’re talking about accomplished men who work in well-paid professions. And in my experience, such men tend to date & marry women who they either met at school or at work who are about the same age as them, not young models & actresses. There’s a reason why such a high percentage of professionals tend to marry each other – you usually date the types of people you see everyday & are in your social circle.

    And quite frankly, when I was dating with an eye towards marriage, I was wary of women who had not really pursued a serious education or career path, had “play” jobs, were subsidized by their parents, or had jobs beneath their intelligence level that indicated a certain type of laziness/lack of drive & work ethic that I just don’t really respect or want in the mother of my kids. Such women made me quite wary of linking my finances to them regardless of how attractive they were, especially with the career I have, which is like a siren call for gold diggers. There’s plenty of attractive women out there who are more “solid” in this respect, and I’d pick them every time.

    Also, I know your post implies that men couldn’t care less what women do…but I must say that a woman who has done interesting things & pursued intellectual interests or talents and become accomplished at them – I think those things do add value & allure to a woman’s overall profile, can make her more respected in important ways and definitely make her stick out from the competition. Besides being intrinsically admirable, they are qualities that bode well for a future wife & mother to your children.

    Having someone else who makes money, can?t cook or clean and is able to hire a cleaning lady is redundant.

    I think you’re underestimating the value of a dual income household – my wife’s & my combined incomes provide us & our kids with a really nice lifestyle above what we could manage individually and a strong base of financial security in the event of a layoff, disability, whatever and allows us to take more risks in terms of future ventures – we don’t worry about money at all and that’s a big deal, especially if you have kids, IMO more so than whether she likes to scrub the bathroom or cook every night. I wouldn’t marry a woman for this reason, but it was a plus factor. Practical things like this matter when you’re talking about marriage.


  6. T.

    Great post as always and I agree with almost all the things you say in describing these ?modern? women. The only thing that worries me though is that such detailed portrayal of these types of girls is just propagating the standard working theory among most men these days is that all women are this way, at least all American women. It is almost the same thing as I read on blogs written by girls describing guys in the same type of broad strokes.

    Sometimes I think girls have become this way just due to the fact there are so many boys out there instead of men that they have nothing else to turn to but Cosmo and other men hating feminist media. I am a big believer in personal accountability, and if guys would just stop buying into what the system (i.e. ? the female dominated advertising and other media) tells them how to be and act like men most of these issues regarding finding a good husband/wife would take care of itself. But that would require free thinking absent fear, and we all know that is in short supply now days.

    zprs last blog post..Being in tune takes effort


  7. T, you’ve done it again. Bravo.


  8. Very good post. You’re absolutely right. Women need to point out why marriage would benefit a man if they want to talk him into marriage. In corporate life, when negotiating a contract, you wouldn’t list off every reason why the deal benefits your company when trying to get the best possible terms.

    But I think your paragraph on the male side of the equation is off the mark a little bit. I don’t think older men become the “prize” because they are more desirable. I think it’s strictly an issue of supply and demand. While most women in their 40′s couldn’t pull off a Demi Moore, it’s socially acceptable for a man in his 40″s to date women younger than themselves (so long as they don’t have children older than the girlfriend). Older men have a bigger dating pool to pull from then older women.

    I don’t believe their income and wealth have much to do with their success, at all. The US Census Bureau shows the median income in 2006 was about $48K/year. Half the population makes an income that is no where near a desirable status and that will never allow them to build wealth.

    20% of the US populations holds 84% of the wealth. That percentage includes women, elderly and married men. The top 1% holds the vast majority of that wealth.

    That means for most men their income and savings is a moot point. They are not wealthy. They will NEVER be top dog in the dating pool using those characteristics, because statistically, they are just like every other man.

    Thus, they need to rely on their looks and personality. And frankly when I look around at the 30+year old men, they are just as overweight and out of shape as the women their age.

    That leaves them with personality. One plus older men have over younger men is that their personality is a known quantity. They are who they are going to be for life. The women who date them, aren’t going to have to wonder what they’ll be like when they “grow up”. It’s the same reason people adopt an older dog from a rescue society rather than buy that adorable puppy from a breeder. You really don’t know what you’re going to end up with personality wise with that puppy.

    Bottom line, I think you’re wrong on what makes older men attractive, but I think you’re correct in that the overwhelming majority of older women do have a harder time finding a spouse then their male counterparts.

    Question: I know you see feminism dogma as part of the problem and I believe you are correct. Candace Bergen’s Murphy Brown character was the first regular character on tv to have a child out of wedlock. It was a BIG feminist deal. After that show, more children were born out of wedlock.

    But at about the same time, there were other shows on tv, like Dallas, that really pushed consumption and materialism. Don’t you think that the cultural shift to materialism left people chronically dissatisfied? Not just dissatisfied with their belongings, but with their spouses and families? Shouldn’t you blame that cultural change just as much as feminism for the divorce rates?


  9. One thing I’ve always thought about marriage is that the sex wouldn’t stop if I could help it. If anything, it would be more rampant. I hope. *awaits ring*

    Seriously, what’s a girl to do… I try to increase my value through being interesting, independent, career-minded and willing to please (but not too much, no ‘welcome’ on MY forehead) and again, I find myself single. No bunnies were boiled. What went wrong? I can only surmise that it wasn’t just about me.

    Y’know T, I was even engaged for a few years. It’s true, though, that without a date, there is no wedding, no marriage; just a ring. And sometimes, that’s what a guy wants: to assert ownership so that the woman feels there’s a commitment, without feeling like a piece of territory.

    (I’ve read that book and it’s one of the best relationship guides ever written, without even trying.)

    china blues last blog post..Songs in the Key of U: Life Lessons from my iPod


  10. China – may I suggest that you’re dating the wrong men? Which is to say, men who do not value the institution of marriage in a deeply rooted way due to their background/family/culture/class/faith, etc. or do not fully expect to be married in the near future? Because, quite frankly, getting married to a “good catch” is really not all that difficult. Most men in this country marry in their 20s. The swinging never married 30-something bachelor is not the norm. The man described in this article strikes me as a waste of time for a marriage-minded woman.

    My husband and the men I dated before I got married all expected to get married. Their parents had been married, most of the people they grew up around were married, and most of their friends were or planned to be married – that was just the normal life path. The idea of having children out of wedlock made no sense to them – because it’s immoral or because that’s what low-class people or you just don’t do that. Outside of places like NYC, this is the mentality of most people who are middle-class or above or who come from good, stable families (and from religious families too, of course, who are certainly a large percentage of the population). Americans are way way more conventional & traditional about this sort of thing than other Western countries.

    If you want to get married, you should not be dating men who need to be convinced that marriage is something they should do. They should believe that long before they ever meet you. And any man who is engaged to you, or living with you for years, does not want to marry you – there’s nothing he’s going to know about you in 4 yrs that he didn’t know after 1.


  11. I would disagree with G and other posters describing the marriage prospects and age of urban, professional men.

    In the cities I’ve lived in: LA, New Orleans, Dallas, Denver, and those I’ve spent some time in: NYC and DC Metro Area, the life-arc for professional men in those metro areas were as follows:

    Post-College, various drudge jobs for a year or two before Grad School to up income, during which low pay, status, not much success with women.

    Grad School: a few hectic years in a pressure cooker where in some schools (Business being notorious) there are only 35% women, in Law School it’s much better, but only a few make lasting connections there. Too much poverty and too much work, with very uncertain lives after graduation.

    Post-Grad School. Several years to establish the career. This takes one into the early to mid thirty range, or beyond. At this point, success kicks in. Men drive a Lexus instead of a Toyota Corolla. And yes, it DOES matter what kind of car you drive in how you date, or even if you get any. Women don’t intimidate, you’re just as happy to watch ESPN or NFL Network if things don’t work out. This is the point where wealth, achievement, security, and self-assurance kick in and make men actively date and seek long term relationships.

    Point being that it can easily take 7-10 years from say, Age 24 to where a man can actively contemplate GETTING married. Since it’s not cheap in the urban job market areas. Which is where most of the young urban professional women are around.

    Your Lawyer, Accountant, CPA, Securities Analyst, Senior Engineer, and the like will at age 35 be dating a woman AT LEAST 5 years and often 7 years younger. Sometimes ten. She might be in Law School, or a local reporter, or junior at work.

    BUT … quite often men at this age are not slovenly bachelors but rather accomplished and neat in their housekeeping. It soon occurs to them that they can cook for themselves, quite cheaply, and keep house, saving significant amounts of money to pay off student loans, car loans, etc. This is vital for them, and when you have a big nut to pay you often look to save money.

    Point being that women offering cooking skills will often find a busy professional has at least if not more skills than they do. That the man is quite settled in his bachelor life, comfortable in it, and it will take something quite different that he doesn’t get to marry. Since most men by their early thirties learn to cook and clean for themselves fairly well.

    What women have to offer, IMHO is comfort, support, and emotional intimacy combined with sex. Even an older woman up against younger, prettier rivals if she offers more comfort, feminine support and succor, true intimacy, can win a marriage proposal and a wedding.

    Consider modern professional life — emotions suppressed and at a distance, constant need to be “professional” and not show any wide swing of emotion, no one to confide in and constant mobility. Often the deadening effect of travel is the worst — the road loneliness is legendary and I can attest, all too real. A wife offers succor from loneliness and isolation, a confidant and best friend who will (hopefully in the “sell” and reality) never betray you.

    That’s worth something. A whole lot IMHO.


  12. Alan and Whiskey both bring up good points.

    What Alan wrote about dual incomes and desirable qualities is worth thinking about. Personally, I value intelligence, not crediential, etc..very highly. I want intelligent children, and I want intelligent interaction between myself and my wife. I don’t care to talk about what celebrities did yesterday, there are more interesting things happening out there in the world.

    As for the dual income, if I’m pulling in enough income where I can comfortably support our family, hey, go me. But if I had a choice, I’d rather have another substantial income for our family, as long as family life was in balance.

    Whiskey talks about the intangibles, it doesn’t matter how pretty, smart, or accomplished a woman is, if there’s no connection, it’s not much more than good (or not even good) sex.

    I stumbled onto the first article, and it captured my attention. The follow up article was even more interesting as I grew up in a divorced family as an only child. I watched my dad leave his house, move to another country and work so that my mom could drive a BMW, eat, go out and shop comfortably. Granted, it was also for me, and I lived comfortably as well, but in my opinion, my mother abused the financial support that my father unconditionally offered.

    Lots of work and 10 years later, my father is successful and finally gets to fulfill his 30+ year dream of owning a Harley. My mother bitches him out, astonished at his boldness in treating himself for once. While she’s dating a rich guy who will get engaged, but not married, while simultaneously asking my father for money.

    Go figure.


  13. Just thought I might add. Incidentally, my father is very happy with a new girlfriend, who he committs fully to.

    But he will not get married again.


  14. What women have to offer, IMHO is comfort, support, and emotional intimacy combined with sex…A wife offers succor from loneliness and isolation, a confidant and best friend who will (hopefully in the ?sell? and reality) never betray you.

    The problem with marriage is that it’s a long-term lock in program where the asset that I’m acquiring doesn’t age well regardless of its current “freshness”. The emotional benefits that you speak of can be easily substituted by a platonic female friend that doesn’t require financial support. The sexual benefits are better met through pornography and masturbation. Most porn stars are better looking than the average woman, and most women will never act or replicate anything done in porn which looks much better than real life sex. The cooking is better met by cooking for myself or by eating out. Cleaning in most cases is easily done by myself or I can arrange for a maid to do so.

    The wife comes across as an quaint idea from an earlier time that makes no sense when all of the components can be outsourced to other specialized people at a better price to service ratio. What’s the incentive to marry somebody who will destroy my independence, ruin me financially, leave me sexually unsatisfied, and secretly desire a male that has more money and alpha tendencies?

    David Alexanders last blog post..The Little Railfan


  15. perhaps i’m leerier of the predatory female nature than most men, but, if a woman were to mention her ostensible outrage at the wall-street divorce scene completely out of the blue, i would become more suspicious than relieved. in this particular vein, the only feedback in which i’d trust would be the woman’s instantaneous (verbal and nonverbal) responses to my casual mention not only of divorce theft, but also of such phenomena as female stars’ having to pay support to their ex-husbands. any show of approval (in the former case) or resentment (in the latter), no matter how slight, would immediately disqualify a woman from any further consideration as marriage material.

    on the other hand, i never cease to be shocked by the naivete of twentysomething men considering marriage. i can’t count the number of otherwise intelligent young men i’ve met, with considerable forbearance in just about every other area of life, who thought about pre-nups and other safeguards with the same disregard – even derision – with which 13-year-olds think about wearing helmets while riding their bikes. “it’ll never happen to me!”

    i also think you’re downplaying, or at least forgetting to mention, the importance of the nurturing, almost maternal side of a potential wife. we all want a woman who will touch our face with a tender hand, who will set the table with hot hearty food on a cold rainy/snowy day, and who will comfort and encourage us in everything.

    also, honesty.
    honesty.
    honesty.
    women lie more than men, about things both small and large.
    if a woman won’t tell her man how much she weighs, she is not marriage material.
    if she won’t give her man honest criticism, without a hint of sarcasm or condescension, she is not marriage material.
    if she doesn’t say as she does and do as she says, she is not marriage material.
    period.
    end of story.

    finally, it doesn’t hurt to be five to ten years younger.


  16. T, this is a great post. However, I’m afriad that we’ve undermined marriage in the U.S. to such an extent that I don’t think its salvagable anymore. In fact, I wouldn’t recommend marriage at all to an American woman. All of the societal constraints that limited the unruly nature of men and women, as well as buttressed the institution of marriage, have been eradicated exposing the primal core of human behavior of which we are in continual denial. We’ve been chipping away at the foundation of what makes us civilized for the last 30+ years and moving behavioral controls and constraints to a larger and more bloated government. If a man wants children and marriage, the only viable solution is to leave the U.S.


  17. Just stumbled on to your blog. I can’t believe you refer to yourself as eccentric. You seem pretty mainstream koolaid drinking american to me. “Get” a man to marry you? Come on, are men products to be acquired? Prizes to be won? I NEVER have met a wife that looks like she has got something better going on than me, why would I strive for that prison. You have no discussion whatsoever about love and spiritual connection (or i missed it) its all a game in your mind. That is pretty bleepin sad. i don’t want any part of a relationship that is based on maneuvers and strategy. can’t believe how many people agree with you. good luck with all the manipulative women in your life…


  18. Consider modern professional life ? emotions suppressed and at a distance, constant need to be ?professional? and not show any wide swing of emotion, no one to confide in and constant mobility. Often the deadening effect of travel is the worst ? the road loneliness is legendary and I can attest, all too real. A wife offers succor from loneliness and isolation, a confidant and best friend who will (hopefully in the ?sell? and reality) never betray you.

    I’ve been thinking about this quite a bit lately. That loneliness is felt by everyone nowadays. A genuine human connection is rare. I am grateful that my husband and I can openly express our emotions to each other verbally and physically, and that we are each other’s best friends.

    You have no discussion whatsoever about love and spiritual connection (or i missed it) its all a game in your mind.

    Love alone is not enough to create or sustain a marriage, but it is of course important. There are lots of misconceptions about love and marriage, and people who only marry for “love” will often become disillusioned afterwards. I do think that it’s pointless for a woman to try to get a man to marry her, if he does not want to, as it would only lead to heartache.

    women lie more than men, about things both small and large.

    My husband lied about a lot of very big things — things that he told everyone around him — and kept the truth from me for years. When he finally did tell me, I forgave him. Just because you have been hurt in your past by women does not make women bigger liars than men. Just look at politicians.

    the importance of the nurturing, almost maternal side of a potential wife. we all want a woman who will touch our face with a tender hand, who will set the table with hot hearty food on a cold rainy/snowy day, and who will comfort and encourage us in everything.

    For the most part, men here and elsewhere still emphasize the youth and beauty of women as the top traits. A woman who cooks well, is caring and comforting would be looked as a platonic companion if she happens to be “fat and ugly,” no matter how hard she tries to please a man or how much she demonstrates her love. I don’t deny that men want the nurturing, empathic wife, but they also want her in a hot, sexy package. This is why women tend to focus on their looks first, and develop their other aspects later, if at all.

    we?ve undermined marriage in the U.S. to such an extent that I don?t think its salvagable anymore.

    It seems ironic to me personally when I think about how if I didn’t get married, I would be able to have more children (especially if I quit my 9-5 job). I know of several different cases where the man does not marry the mother of his children, because she is living off of governmental assistance, and he benefits from it as well (I know of cases where the father does not even work at all, and simply lazes around living off her checks). The government is the other side of the equation — the state aggressively seeks money from fathers, biological or not, because of so many people leeching off the system.


  19. johnny five, correct. The stupidity and ignorance of guys in their 20′s nowadays is amazing. They don’t get it that women are more cunning, shrewd and manipulative than they are, and that the love and marriage that sustained and grew our country is OVER. Ended mainly by rich, spoiled bored women who decided that women should be “liberated” from their true natures as wives and mothers.

    Any man today needs to be constantly monitoring his relationship for any strange occurrences. Women will lie and cheat with little or no guilt.

    There are certain requirements to have for a wife:

    takes care of herself physically, optimistic, hard-working, caring, and most of all loyal. That loyalty should be judged throughout the relationship and engagement. If she comes from a family with very few divorces, she will probably be less likely to do it herself. Women and men used to work together in life. Feminists decided it would be better to compete with men. They got their wish, and now men are starting to play the game too.


  20. Wow, too much stuff to comment to everything, but I do want to address one comment in particular:

    i don?t want any part of a relationship that is based on maneuvers and strategy. can?t believe how many people agree with you.

    People agree with me because I’m pretty awesome.

    If you think it’s possible to have a zero-manipulation relationship, you’re delusional. If you conveniently leave out any information that may reflect on you negatively for fear of scaring off a potential mate, you’re manipulating. If you are a woman and you are wearing a bra that accentuates your cleavage to make your boobs look bigger, that’s a manipulation. Do you wear makeup? Well hey, your lips aren’t naturally that red, your complexion isn’t that naturally flawless and your cheeks aren’t naturaly that rosy. You’re manipulating. If you’re a guy, do you try to dress nicely and bring up your gainful employment and avoid talking about your life setbacks? Do you occasionally exaggerate to make a good impression? You’re manipulating. Do you choose what you say and do to others based on what will gain you the optimal positive result? Anything that is said or done with the goal of making someone like you is a manipulation. The art of persuasive conversation in general is manipulation.

    Stop being a Pollyanna. This is a blog called the Rawness, not Convenient Sugarcoated Fiction.


  21. My deary,

    Kids are supposed to benefit CERTAINLY from marriage. Not adults.


  22. From reading this entire article, I must conclude that men overall suck. Thank goodness my husband didn’t marry me just because he thought I was cute, but because I want to further my education, I can be quite sassy, contribute more to our relationship than domestic skills, and challenge him instead of being a drone. Imagine that. And oh yeah, I got married before age 25.

  23. SchadenfreudianSlip on October 23rd, 2009 at 12:54 PM

    It IS amazing at how bass-ackwards women have become. There’s a rather uppitty woman at work who–despite the fact no one asked her–chimed in a discussion of recipes, mostly discussed by men: “I don’t cook” with an air of such superiority…I nearly spewed my coke when her comments went “plop” into the toilet of irrelvancy.


  24. I’m in my mid 30′s and thank god I smartened up before it was too late. A couple of years ago, I spent almost every dime I had on a full body and face plastic surgery make over. I looked about 7 years younger and a whole lot prettier. Almost immediately, the male attention started flooding in. With so many options, obviously I became more confident. And confident plus good looks is a winning combination. Now I’m happily engaged to a man my own age in a high earning profession. Ladies, if you are single and in your 30′s and 40′s, instead of a down payment on a home, put a down payment on your body. Plastic surgery is a great equalizer. I’m a well educated woman with a graduate degree from one of the Ivy Leagues- all I wanted was a chance to find a partner of my equal intelligence- and in order to do that you’ve got to be a hell of a lot better looking than him. Of course, my fiance knows about my surgeries now, but by that time, he had already gotten to know about all the other wonderful things I had to offer, and yes, he does admit that the initial attraction was to my “hotness”.

  25. peace is every step on May 12th, 2010 at 12:52 PM

    Okay, I have a bit of an argument but not necessarily that I think all you say isn’t true…just some of it….I noticed that a lot of ppl always mention the 20s and late teens as being the most attractive time of a woman’s life. I have a bit of a rebuttal…think Eva Mendes, Halle Berry, even Drew Barrymore (yes, I know not hot, but definitely more beautiful now)…all when they hit their 30s were at their most beautiful. I don’t think it’s just because they are all hot anyway. Look at Halle’s face at 25 and then when she was like 34. Her face really came into it’s own. More angular but still youthful…womanly not baby-like and baby fat like as in her 20s. She even said this of herself when looking at pictures of herself in her 20s. I think for a lot of women that are still single in their early to mid 30s and didn’t ruin their bodies yet with child birth, they can say the same–esp of their faces (that are less stressed due to lack of children).
    And again, this is not only because they are just hot in general. Their hotness increased. Me, for example, I’m a regular 26 year old woman. I’d say, on average, I’m about a 7 to most men, an 8 or 9 to ones that I really fit their type. When I was 18-21 I looked 16 or 17–ILLEGAL and still had baby fat on my face. I didn’t dress well. When I hit 25 I felt all types and all ages of men notice me more and more at a different level. When the older men who approached me at 21 (me looking 17) acted like perverts. The ones now, of all ages, don’t ask me anything, they have started to call me beautiful.
    And my bf (of six years mind you) says the same. He has always told me the early to mid 30s were the most beautiful most women are if they haven’t had kids yet not the teens (he thinks that’s gross) or the 20s (late 20s though). So, I think you are right. But most of these “your 20s are when it’s the best/30s are all downhill” advice things I have read are not completely true.
    I have been planning to give my bf the ultimatum before 27, though. Because as I think I am growing more beautiful each year since 25 (as my bf also pointed out) I am also growing smarter and realize that although I argue the peak is actually 25-34 of looks (not necessarily fertility as I get that 18-34 is) I have to do something and not waste those last years, because they are limited (just not as much, lookswise to me as they are often portrayed) and even with 7 years, 7 years is still not much.


  26. Okay, I have a bit of an argument but not necessarily that I think all you say isn’t true…just some of it….I noticed that a lot of ppl always mention the 20s and late teens as being the most attractive time of a woman’s life. I have a bit of a rebuttal…think Eva Mendes, Halle Berry, even Drew Barrymore (yes, I know not hot, but definitely more beautiful now)…all when they hit their 30s were at their most beautiful. I don’t think it’s just because they are all hot anyway. Look at Halle’s face at 25 and then when she was like 34. Her face really came into it’s own. More angular but still youthful…womanly not baby-like and baby fat like as in her 20s. She even said this of herself when looking at pictures of herself in her 20s. I think for a lot of women that are still single in their early to mid 30s and didn’t ruin their bodies yet with child birth, they can say the same–esp of their faces (that are less stressed due to lack of children).
    And again, this is not only because they are just hot in general. Their hotness increased. Me, for example, I’m a regular 26 year old woman. I’d say, on average, I’m about a 7 to most men, an 8 or 9 to ones that I really fit their type. When I was 18-21 I looked 16 or 17–ILLEGAL and still had baby fat on my face. I didn’t dress well. When I hit 25 I felt all types and all ages of men notice me more and more at a different level. When the older men who approached me at 21 (me looking 17) acted like perverts. The ones now, of all ages, don’t ask me anything, they have started to call me beautiful.
    And my bf (of six years mind you) says the same. He has always told me the early to mid 30s were the most beautiful most women are if they haven’t had kids yet not the teens (he thinks that’s gross) or the 20s (late 20s though). So, I think you are right. But most of these “your 20s are when it’s the best/30s are all downhill” advice things I have read are not completely true.
    I have been planning to give my bf the ultimatum before 27, though. Because as I think I am growing more beautiful each year since 25 (as my bf also pointed out) I am also growing smarter and realize that although I argue the peak is actually 25-34 of looks (not necessarily fertility as I get that 18-34 is) I have to do something and not waste those last years, because they are limited (just not as much, lookswise to me as they are often portrayed) and even with 7 years, 7 years is still not much

    we like them in their early 20′s late teens, not 25 and up couagrs, this whole post is so proifically stupid

    celebs were better when younger too stop being silly


  27. Zac:

    well, then I guess you guys THINK SO but you really don’t always know when you look at women and approach us. Case in point: I am 30 in three years. Each, year, after turning 25, men have constantly come up to me –more than ever! in supermarkets, the parking lot, out, at work. I never got so much attention when I was younger (except for 40 year olds that thought I was underage when I was 21–perverts….). Perhaps, it is because some women (who don’t go tanning like me or smoke or just have plain old good genes) are different than others.

    When you reach the mid 20s to early 30s, so long as you took care of yourself and didn’t smoke tan and got enough exercise, you should still look great, and depending if you are one of those luckier women who age well, even better at 33. And you think a cougar is 25, Zac?? What is the prime to you then, 16?? Ick…I wonder how half of these men look themselves that say things like that.

    Believe me. All the men that approach me have no problem with the fact that I am 27. In fact, I lie to get them away sometimes and say I am 30, they get MORE intrigued. Another thing, I do agree there is a cut off point some where. Most ppl in general, start to show the signs of aging somehow in the 40s. This is for MEN AND WOMEN. But, the 30s vs. the 20s are debatable, men or women can look better in either decade depending on their lifestyle and genetics. Perhaps, this is true for ME because my MOTHER has good genes and said she looked her best at the early 30s. Not the 20s. I also don’t go tanning, don’t smoke, and cook all my own food. There you go. You can’t just generalize everyone. If I get more men approaching me 18-all the way up to 40 something now more than BEFORE, There is a difference. Halle at 25 not so much. Halle Berry at 33 WOW. Halle Berry at 40 today, okay, but not as beautiful as 33 or 34. If you wanna keep arguing check her pictures. She did those Spike Lee films in her 20s, she also won that beauty pageant in her 20s. In her 30s she did swordfish and James Bond. When was she more hot?? The 30s!!! Like Halle, other women can age well, also. Now, I Agree, at 40, like I said, she looked way better in the 30s, but you can’t just generalized (this site either) every woman as being hot in the 20s and less so in the 30s. It just isn’t true. And I know for me FOR SURE it wont be.


  28. Zac:

    well, then I guess you guys THINK SO but you really don’t always know when you look at women and approach us. Case in point: I am 30 in three years. Each, year, after turning 25, men have constantly come up to me –more than ever! in supermarkets, the parking lot, out, at work. I never got so much attention when I was younger (except for 40 year olds that thought I was underage when I was 21–perverts….). Perhaps, it is because some women (who don’t go tanning like me or smoke or just have plain old good genes) are different than others.

    When you reach the mid 20s to early 30s, so long as you took care of yourself and didn’t smoke tan and got enough exercise, you should still look great, and depending if you are one of those luckier women who age well, even better at 33. And you think a cougar is 25, Zac?? What is the prime to you then, 16?? Ick…I wonder how half of these men look themselves that say things like that.

    Believe me. All the men that approach me have no problem with the fact that I am 27. In fact, I lie to get them away sometimes and say I am 30, they get MORE intrigued. Another thing, I do agree there is a cut off point some where. Most ppl in general, start to show the signs of aging somehow in the 40s. This is for MEN AND WOMEN. But, the 30s vs. the 20s are debatable, men or women can look better in either decade depending on their lifestyle and genetics. Perhaps, this is true for ME because my MOTHER has good genes and said she looked her best at the early 30s. Not the 20s. I also don’t go tanning, don’t smoke, and cook all my own food. There you go. You can’t just generalize everyone. If I get more men approaching me 18-all the way up to 40 something now more than BEFORE, There is a difference. Halle at 25 not so much. Halle Berry at 33 WOW. Halle Berry at 40 today, okay, but not as beautiful as 33 or 34. If you wanna keep arguing check her pictures. She did those Spike Lee films in her 20s, she also won that beauty pageant in her 20s. In her 30s she did swordfish and James Bond. When was she more hot?? The 30s!!! Like Halle, other women can age well, also. Now, I Agree, at 40, like I said, she looked way better in the 30s, but you can’t just generalized (this site either) every woman as being hot in the 20s and less so in the 30s. It just isn’t true. And I know for me FOR SURE it wont be.

    you’re delusional


  29. Okay, even I’m getting sick of the years of endless back and forth on this topic already. Comments closed.