Comments on: Subtle Alpha Dominance

By: T.

T. — Fri, 20 Jun 2008 21:42:15 +0000

Ben - he could have done a couple of things without punching or smacking him. He could have laughed and shrugged off what Moyers was saying too, and mirrored his body language. He could have occasionally placed his hand on Moyer’s shoulder, nudged him in the arm playfully, just do similar type of body language that showed that he too didn’t take Moyers or the exchange too seriously. He could not have responded to when Moyers tried to push his buttons. For example, when Moyers acted like he forgot his name and asked him to repeat it or got it wrong on purpose, instead of validating that with a response, turn it into a negative on Moyers’ part by saying something while laughing like “Geez, man, I know you’re getting up there but you’re getting senile already? How many things have you forgotten in this conversation so far? Must suck to be getting old, you used to be known for a great memory and being sharp. You’re supposed to be a top journalist, man! Remembering names is like Journalism 101.” Then laugh good-naturedly. Tease him back like that. Not only would that have made Moyers look worse for forgetting his name, but now Moyers can’t use the name forgetting play any more in the conversation because now it’s associated with Moyer’s senility rather than the producer’s low status. He could also casually brush off Moyers hand from his shoulder when he places it there, and make jokes like “You need to at least by me dinner first.” Since Moyers is making light of his youth and inexperience and using it to contrast against Moyers experience and maturity, the producer can flip the contrast game back on Moyers and call him things like “pops” or do things that subtly imply that he’s over the hill, in his decline, etc. But by answering Moyers questions while allowing Moyers to deflect his own questions and stammering and speaking too fast and getting defensive and taking it more seriously than Moyers, he really screwed himself over.

VK - I heard about She Wants Revenge last year actually, a few months before they appeared on Timbaland’s album. Speaking of Timbaland’s album…boy what a disappointment that album was. Outside of a few choice tracks, it was a steaming turd overall.

By: virgle kent

virgle kent — Fri, 20 Jun 2008 14:31:06 +0000

Man I saw this Jank on Keith Olberman when it first aired and it was so sweet how O’Reilly got punked. At the same time I never new white people could get so gangster (in their own way). I think that’s the coolest thing I’ve been learning watching politics so closely this year. Also about she wants revenge, I’m surprised you’re just now hearing about them, Walkeen Phonex (Yeah I butchered the fuck out of that name) directed their first video which was pretty sweet and then they where on Timbaland’s last joint and had a good track on their too.

Holla

virgle kents last blog post..The Coronation of A Prince

By: Ben

Ben — Thu, 19 Jun 2008 22:54:08 +0000

What would the appropriate alpha reaction be though? Its not like that O’Reilly reporter can just punch or smack Moyers for his disrespect.

By: T

Wed, 18 Jun 2008 14:37:17 +0000

DF - so agreed on O’Reilly and on Anderson Cooper.

By: DF

DF — Wed, 18 Jun 2008 14:26:51 +0000

T, this is an excellent deconstruction of dominance but note that Moyers had a leg up from the get go. Moyers is taller, which is very advantageous when being “attacked” and its easier to be more paternalistic from that perspective. Moyers is also well known for his very calm disposition - the needle in the compass on a storm tossed ship. I’m conservative but no one gives me the urge to take a dump on their face more than Bill O’Reilly, except for Anderson Cooper but I’m afraid the Coop might be turned on by that.

By: T.

T. — Tue, 17 Jun 2008 21:08:52 +0000

Dev - absolutely right about being careful who you try this stuff on. I think that’s why Moyers starts off with small emasculation and builds up to things like the face slap after several minutes of gradual escalation. To start off from jump with things like the face slap would have been riskier.

Abhs - yeah, many people recommend the stoic non-reaction, but I agree amused condescension works better.

Rick - bad wording on my part. I meant in general in regards to politics I hardly ever agree with Bill Moyers. I didn’t mean that I disagree with his assessment of Bill O’Reilly in this specific exchange.

By: Rick

Rick — Tue, 17 Jun 2008 20:47:00 +0000

Agree with your analysis completely. It’s all subtle, effective, etc. I would add, though, that Moyers is doing it in a genuine way. He’s not so much ‘applying techniques’ to gain dominance, he’s simply trying to demonstrate that the fellow is misguided in a calm, professional, and very effective way. Though, you can tell he’s pretty annoyed with the guy and probably wants to actually slap him, but he obviously has restraint as would be expected of an adult.

Also, I know I’ve been like Liberal Guy on here, but how can you say you “agree with pretty much nothing Moyers says”? He very clearly delineates the background of the conflict and calls O’Reilly, Murdoch, and the producer all out for their absurdity. I don’t see what is not to agree with. Props to you though for being willing to characterize the exchange in the way that you do without doing what O’Reilly did on his show - taking things out of context and ignoring key point. I love how O’Reilly just dismisses him as a ‘nutjob’ or whatever. Super beta.

By: Abhs

Abhs — Tue, 17 Jun 2008 16:55:30 +0000

“Moyer’s attitude toward the producer never rises above the benign, amused condescension that an adult shows toward a clueless child that is trying to challenge you but is so beneath your full efforts.”

Excellent. Being a slight bit patronizing is far more effective at stopping social “attacks” slash tests (i love prissy girls) than simply appearing unaffected. For one, if you aim to be stoic, the attacker can hold strong to the belief that if they keep attacking they will eventually wear you down. Everybody is taught to try and “rise above” displays of dominance from the time they are in elementary school (sticks and stones..) but I didn’t know many 5th graders that can contemptuously cut bullies down to size by words alone. Those that did, did so by displaying higher levels of consciousness (superiority). Last thought: being patronizing brings to mind thoughts of one’s childhood, and your paternal units. I don’t think there is any human relationship that is more submissive than the child to the father, not even slave to master. This is why it is good sense to cause a chick to subconsciously misconstrue you as her father.

By: DevX

DevX — Tue, 17 Jun 2008 16:43:27 +0000

Wow, I hadn’t seen the O’Reilly clip before with their own analysis of this! Even O’Reilly admits that his own guy got dominated in this interchange. That face pat was just classic.

My recommendation is that I’d pick and choose who you use some of these moves with. Its a very effective technique, when used against someone who won’t/can’t defend against it. The verbal techniques would work well on anyone. But if you go around bars trying out the physicial techniques (especially that face pat) against another aggressive alpha male, the situation will likely escalate and lead to a physical confrontation.

I’d recommend everyone watch this at least a couple times to internalize what T was talking about here. Good job man.